<< What Bush said is true, however I'm sure he knows it's not the only reason. I've watched Muslim clerics interviewed, and ever the moderates say they don't likes Americas way of life, especially women having freedom and the right to vote, and we know this, becasue women don't have very many rights in most Islamic countries >>

No, Bush said, "America was targeted for attack because we're the brightest beacon for freedom and opportunity in the world."

That is a lie. The FBI told the truth, American was targeted because bin Laden hates what American foreign policies do to him and the people in his region. The terrorists attacked in order to terrorize the public into forcing their government to change the policies. This has been explained by the FBI and stated by bin Laden.
Clearly the terrorists did not attack because of our freedoms, they went and got lap dances and drank alcohol.

information clearing house
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article4110.htm
NOTICE the media once again sweeps a Bush whopper under the rug!

"The larger point is, and the fundamental question is, did Saddam Hussein have a weapons program? And the answer is, absolutely. And we gave him a chance to allow the inspectors in, and he wouldn't let them in. And, therefore, after a reasonable request, we decided to remove him from power," - President Bush.07/15/03

President Caught In Another Lie of total delusion.
Bush is not fit to be President. Republicans, don't open your mouths like pathetic robots and start making excuses for this clown. This guy has to go. And of cource MOST Americans don't know about this since the media has once agains swept another Bush lie under the rug. (BUSH LIED ABOUT WHY WE WERE TARGETED ON 9/11 also)
There is no way that Clinto would have been let off the hook for such a delusional statement. The media is not doing what you think it is doing. The SERVE POWER. wake up. we need a Representative Media NOW!
information clearing house

<< now the media is behind you about the Bush lie. >>
yet the media is still downplaying it. ALSO the media is still playing games. They didn't report this:
Bush is totally out of control (he stated that Saddam didn't let the inspectors in!)
People think the media reports all important news stories and that the only issue is how that news is presented. This isn't the case. Probably the most harm done by major media is in what they withhold from the public.
It is crazy that we can hear about the Israel astronaut's mission from 20 years ago but no one in mainstream media thought it important enough to make it clear to the public that the U.S.'s CIA helped put the Ba'ath party into power in the first place.

<< I'm not the one calling for the destruction of a nation which any clear minded person knows can only be accomplished through violence and the death of millions.
That's you, you sick piece of shit. >>


there is something EXTREMELY TWISTED about the Zionist mentality.

No other ideology lays it on so thick and so over the board nasty and offensive.

Any attempt to call for an end to their vile system and they use the most obnoxious and sick tactics anyone has ever resorted to.
There is something very unhealthy about the Zionist apologists here in America.
People that called for the end to South Africa's unjust system were not subjected to these kind of fanatical attacks.
People that called for the end to South Africa's unjust system did not get accused of "calling for the deaths of millions."
People that called for the end to South Africa's unjust system did not get attacked with slurs and underhanded insinuations.
People that called for the end to South Africa's unjust system didn't get constantly subjected to excuses and vile insinuations that every wrong across Africa must be mentioned otherwise one is "calling for MASS MURDER and GENOCIDE"
People that called for the end to South Africa's unjust system didn't get called "he sickest piece of garbage"
But of course your agenda insists that Israel and its supporters get treated differently.
Your agenda has bullied and threatened and used influence to make the mainstream media play your tune.
"It's not like when you talk about lobbying organizations for say immigrants or the disabled or the Saudi Government for that matter. History, sensitivity and politics make talk of Israel and its supporters different and alot more complicated. I'm John Donvan for Nightline in Washington." -broadcast 4/17/02 ABC's Nightline
so no one can dare call for justice if the violator of human rights is Israel? you guys are too much.

<< Seizing most of the land and pushing 300,000 people of their land
IS AN ATTACK. The Zionists were attacking and killing to grab the land and
ethnically cleanse (this was BEFORE MAY 1948) The Arab countries RESPONDED to
the Zionists land grab, your claim that Israel did not attack is false. >>

Bull!! I have read various articles both Arab and Israeli. The Violence started almost immediately after the partitioning plan was announced November 1947 yes before May 1948. When the partitioning plan was announce the Arab spokesman announced to the UN, Arabs would drench "the soil of our beloved country with the last drop of our blood. Fighting, rioting etc.. ensued. Are you saying Jamal Husseini, the Arab High Committee's spokesman and the so called protector of the Arabs was kidding when he made that statement??? >>

Stop playing games. Are you so brainwashed that you don't know the difference between right and wrong? Are you an American or not? Do you believe in justice and democracy?

33% of Palestine had no right to push for a plan to take most of the land for themselves and insist on a government based on their religion. (this violates the basics that America stands for)
Do you seriously not understand that? What is your agenda here? Democracy and justice doesn't matter if the 33% pushing for un-American values such as violating most (67%) of the peoples' rights happen to be Jews? Is this basically what you are saying? Do you know what American values are? Why do you make excuses for such undemocratic and unjust deeds?

And that percentage would not have even been that high if the British had not denied the population of Palestine the right of self determination. Why do you act as if any of these actions are fair or just?
Why do you quote someone and act like defending your land and human rights is a bad thing? Go look at you pro-Israeli sites and see if you can find them even mentioning the population stats and land ownership percentages. Look which side has things to hide (and they get away with it)

The Zionists used their influence in America to push through such a lopsided and unjust plan. Do you seriously not know this? Why do you act like such a plan is even close to fair? What is the deal with you and Israel? Why are you going out of your way to try to make horrible unjust actions sound reasonable?

By the way, your other comments are basically racists. The Palestinians are not responsible for other undemocratic Arab states, And you act as if the other Arab rulers acted in the interests of the Palestinians, but the didn't. So stop acting like the Palestinians were being helped by the Arabs states. Jordan and Egypt seized Palestinian lands. What happened in 1948 was Zionists and Arab states stole land from the Palestinians. Twisting it to something else is Zionist propaganda.

Retnav4986,
You claim that you know the facts yet you regurgitate Israeli propaganda. you must understand why what people think they know is important. you have so many errors that I will only look at some of them here.

<< justify continued violence such as the right of return. >>

First of all, the right of return is not "violence". Your comment is very extreme.
Second, the right of return is not a suggestion or proposal, it is a right under international law. And Israel was admitted into the UN on condition that it honor the Palestinian's right of return.
Israel was accepted into the United Nations on condition that it accept the Right of Return of the Palestinian refugees. Admission of Israel to membership in the United Nations (General Assembly Resolution 273 of May 11, 1949 ) requires Israel to comply with General Assembly Resolution 194 of December 11, 1948 and Israel stated it agreed to comply with this resolution.

Third, the UN did not set the boundries of Israel. The UN proposal was never put int effect. that proposal suggested 56% of Palestine for the Jewish state. The Zionists DID NOT ACCEPT THE UN PROPOSAL. BEFOR MAY 1948, the Zionists seized land well beyond the 56% up to 77% percent stolen (keep in mind that Jews only owened 6% of the land and were only 33% of the population)
BEFORE May 1948 they had already ethnically cleansed 300,000 people to achieve their "demographic purity"

You have fallen for the ZIonists propaganda since you think the UN partition plan is what established Israel. As I have shown the plan was never put into effect. The Zionists then seized as much land as possible (even huge portions of land that had been suggested as the Palestinian state) and had ethnically cleansed 300,000 people (they would go on after May 1948 to ethnically cleanse another 350,000 people)

<< In 1948 before the partitioning plan was put into effect >>
as I have pointed out, the plan was never put into effect. (by the way key Zionists made it clear it was only a step in taking over all of Palestine)

<< t is a 2 state solution was viable. The Armies of Egypt, Lebanon, Iraq, and Syria attacked Israel. Israel did not attack them. >>
WRONG. siezing most of the land and pushing 300,000 people of of their land IS AN ATTACK. The Zionists were attacking and killing to grab the land and ethnically cleanse (this was BEFORE MAY 1948) The Arab countries RESPONDED to the Zionists land grab, your claim that Israel did not attack is false.

What you should think about is why you have so many facts wrong. the reason is that Israeli propganda dominates U.S. media and education. This is power and it is abused. Look into these facts and you will see how it is misrepresented so that you come away with the false impressions that you hold.

This should show you how much of a probnlem we haev with the media and education system here in America.

What you think you know is the result of what has been presented to you and what has been withheld. Take the time to check the fatcs and then think about what extreme manipulations are occring in this country. You have to ask your self if you want to know the truth or do you want to be manipulated.
"The greatest weapon in the hands of the oppressor is the mind of the oppressed -Stephen Biko (1946-1977) South

<< What's the best way to achieve peace in a region that has known so much war? Could a simple solution be to financially tie all the parties together and make it more profitable to all parties to work together? Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah make to much sense. >>

What nonsense are you trying to sell?
First of all, it is clear you don't understand why there isn't peace concerning Israel and the Palestinians. I get the distinct impression that you don't understand the basic issue that the Zionists insist on violating the rights of millions of people.
But we can put that issue aside for now, the point I was making is that the Iraqis are supposed to be able to make decisions about their own country. The U.S. should not be tying any of the parties into anything. You clearly don't understand the extreme injustices carried out by the Zionists and why people would rightly not want to support or enable such an unjust regime as the Israelis have pushed.
SO no, forcing Iraqis to financially benefit Israel is not only unjust because Iraqis should not be forced to do business with a country they don't like, the policies of Israel are unjust and it is wrong to help them.

You danced around the main point (as Cookie has also) that the story of U.S. and Israeli policy makers pipeline plans has not been reported to most Americans in mainstream media. Reporters in mainstream media "play the game" by not reporting this story. The story reveals too much. It reveals that democracy is not planned for Iraqis. Mainstream reporters keep their jobs by not reporting these kinds of things. This happens by reporters either playing the game consciously or blindly, either way they keep their jobs because of the things the report and don't report.

You seem to assume noble actions and intentions in U.S. foreign policies. This is due adherence to an idea that since these policies are U.S. polices the "must be" noble and good. A point most people don;t understand is mainstream media plays along with this premise. It is more profitable to do so and the people that influence the news coverage like to present this view of the world. This is accomplished by what they report and what they don't report. Another major story not reported to most Americans is how the Baath party and how Saddam came into power in the first place. It is clear mainstream media's bias is catering to a world view that owners and those that influence the news prefer. So the U.S. role in putting the Baath party in power in Iraq goes unreported to most Americans. The corporations that broadcast the news are not serving the public good, they are serving their own interests and withholding facts like these serves their interests more that reporting it.

You need to step back and look at what is really happening. Read "Understanding power" and "manufacturing Consent" by Noam Chomsky.

Just try to think, would you want a foreign country trying you to anything against your wishes?

test

May 1998 interview with Bin Laden answering questions.
... What is the meaning of your call for Muslims to take arms against America in particular, and what is the message that you wish to send to the West in general?
The call to wage war against America was made because America has spear-headed the crusade against the Islamic nation, sending tens of thousands of its troops to the land of the two Holy Mosques over and above its meddling in its affairs and its politics, and its support of the oppressive, corrupt and tyrannical regime that is in control. These are the reasons behind the singling out of America as a target. And not exempt of responsibility are those Western regimes whose presence in the region offers support to the American troops there. We know at least one reason behind the symbolic participation of the Western forces and that is to support the Jewish and Zionist plans for expansion of what is called the Great Israel. Surely, their presence is not out of concern over their interests in the region. ... Their presence has no meaning save one and that is to offer support to the Jews in Palestine who are in need of their Christian brothers to achieve full control over the Arab Peninsula which they intend to make an important part of the so called Greater Israel.

...For over half a century, Muslims in Palestine have been slaughtered and assaulted and robbed of their honor and of their property. Their houses have been blasted, their crops destroyed. frontline: hunting bin laden: who is bin laden?É

Read from the first-ever television interview with Osama Bin Ladin was conducted by Peter Arnett in eastern Afghanistan in late March 1997:

We declared jihad against the US government, because the US government is unjust, criminal and tyrannical. It has committed acts that are extremely unjust, hideous and criminal whether directly or through its support of the Israeli occupation of the Prophet's Night Travel Land (Palestine). And we believe the US is directly responsible for those who were killed in Palestine, Lebanon and Iraq.
... Those hundreds of thousands who have been killed or displaced in Iraq, Palestine, Lebanon, do have brothers and relatives.
.... A man with human feelings in his heart does not distinguish between a child killed in Palestine or in Lebanon, in Iraq or in Bosnia. So how can we believe your claims that you came to save our children in Somalia while you kill our children in all of those places?
...So, the US is responsible for any reaction, because it extended its war against troops to civilians. This is what we say. As for what you asked regarding the American people, they are not exonerated from responsibility, because they chose this government and voted for it despite their knowledge of its crimes in Palestine, Lebanon, Iraq and in other places and its support of its agent regimes who filled our prisons with our best children and scholars. We ask that may God release them.

REPORTER: Mr. Bin Ladin, will the end of the United States' presence in Saudi Arabia, their withdrawal, will that end your call for jihad against the United States and against the US ?
BIN LADIN: The cause of the reaction must be sought and the act that has triggered this reaction must be eliminated. The reaction came as a result of the US aggressive policy towards the entire Muslim world and not just towards the Arabian peninsula. So if the cause that has called for this act comes to an end, this act, in turn, will come to an end. So, the driving-away jihad against the US does not stop with its withdrawal from the Arabian peninsula, but rather it must desist from aggressive intervention against Muslims in the whole world.

Transcript of Osama Bin Ladin interview by PeteÉ

"I usually have some reason and can tell you what it is"
such is the claim by one of the poseters here yet when solid facts are presented all they can do is respond with:
"anti-semitic"
"not a valid argment"


yet when a perfect example of suppression of information from the American public is revealed, all they can do is call names and cast doubt WITHOUT even addressing the post!!

ZNet | Mideast | The Complex Art Of Simulation
"in his meeting with U.S. president George Bush at the Aqaba summit, prime-minister Ariel Sharon will seek the U.S. backing of his demand that the Palestinian authority will use forceful [military] means against the terror organizations and their infrastructure in the territories, as a precondition for any diplomatic advance. Sharon will tell Bush that it is not acceptable to settle just for agreements between the Palestinian organizations to a cease fire " In return Sharon will promise Bush that Israel will evacuate illegal outposts in the West bank ” (Ha’aretz Hebrew edition, Aluf Ben, June 2, 2003).
Is it just an accident that in the internet English version of Ha'aretz, this piece of information was eliminated altogether, and the headline announced only Sharon's willingness to evacuate outposts?

I would say it is not an accident. this is intentional suppresion of facts from the American public. And it is part of the ongoing partern. You can look at case after case where the US media suppresses or severly downplays events in Israel and Palestine.


Following the 4 June Aqaba summit between President Bush and Israeli and Palestinian leaders, the US media fell quickly into the pattern of ignoring or severely downplaying Israeli attacks on Palestinians, and playing up Palestinian counterviolence as a threat to a budding "peace process."

Yet The Guardian (British newspaper)'s Conal Urquhart reported that "As George Bush talked about peace with the Israeli and Palestinian prime ministers, Israeli soldiers were raiding the refugee camp of Balata and the city of Nablus for the third day running." ("Children shot in third day of Israeli army raids, The Guardian, 5 June 2003)

Urquhart described how "screams echoed around the clinic" in the camp, "as a woman brought her seven-year-old daughter in for treatment. She had been shot in the abdomen by an Israeli soldier" as the Aqaba summit took place. Later the same day, the report said, a boy was shot in the head with a rubber-coated bullet.

According to the Red Crescent, The Guardian reported, "some 50 people have been treated for bullet and shrapnel wounds" in two days. The American pulic is being made fools out of. How is this possible? Many forces are at work to keep these facts from the American public. We can't ignore the fact that if someone dares point things like this out, they get attacked and the reports are labled "drivel". YET THEY DON"T BACK UP A SINGLE DIRTY ALLEGATION. THE ATTEMPT IS TO INTIMIDATE AND CONTINUE THE SUPPRESSION OF THESE FACTS.

Dr. Samir Abu Zarzur, the head of the casualty department at Rafiah hospital in Nablus, said that his department treated 32 people injured by the Israeli army on Tuesday, the day President Bush was meeting the Palestinians' Mahmoud Abbas and other Arab leaders in Sharm Al-Sheikh and urging them to join a struggle against "terrorism."
http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=22&ItemID=3760

<< I've done my homework and have determined that the roots of Islamic extremism >>
thanks for putting some info together. But I must point out that what I have been arguing is not the roots of Islamic extremism but rather why are the terrorists targeting us. Fair enough? The topic is "Hate for the U.S."

From an interview found on Al Jazzeera website taken by reporter Taysir Alouni, following the WTC attack:
(From what you quoted I searched and the next paragraph is:)
"The proof came when the U.S. government pressured the media not to run our statements that are not longer than very few minutes. They felt that the truth started to reach the American people, the truth that we are not terrorists as they understand it but because we are being attacked in Palestine, Iraq, Lebanon, Sudan, Somalia, Kashmir, the Philippines and everywhere else."

<< has far less to do with US policies than it does with religion and oppression of the region which has fostered a rage -a rage that has been turned away from the real source to a common enemy that appeals to the religious themselves -western culture, values and governments.
>>

The terrorists (for example the 19 men from 9/11 and the shoe bomber) clearing are reacting to U.S. policies and actions. bin Laden wants to set up a very fundamentalist version of Islam. bin Laden gains support for the terrorism campaign by pointing out the abused of U.S. policies. Many people, MANY that would never resort to terrorism, don't like the U.S. policies. Others that join his jihad against the U.S. don't share the same religions convictions. (for example 9/11 hijackers were video taped getting lap dances from strippers and drinking alcohol).

bin Laden wants to make it a religious campaign. Yet we know that the U.S. has supported and worked with the world's most fundamentalist regimes.

Clearly what stands between ANYONE making changes in the region is the U.S. and the West. Many would want societies very different from what bin Laden wants.
It should be pointed out that many that wanted modernization have been killed with the help of the U.S. The U.S. funded with BILLIONS of dollars the same fundamentalist Islam that bin Laden supports, in the process killing many that wanted modern and progressive government.

The governments that bin Laden (and others that hate terrorism) hate are propped up by the U.S. the motive? Greed.
"U.S. support for almost any ruler [often against the wishes of his people] willing to protect U.S. interests, routinely identified in Washington as oil and Israel... It is dangerous to divorce terrorism from politics, yet the U.S. media continue to talk about an abstract war against terrorism without mention of the issues or context that lie behind them. ... Democratization "is not on the American agenda" in the Middle East. The reason? Because Washington finds it more efficient to support a range of dictators across the Arab world as long as they conform to U.S. foreign policy needs."- Graham E. Fuller former CIA 8/24/98

You can go back 40 years and find President Eisenhower talking about the campaign of hatred against us in the Middle East and youÕll find the National Security council giving the reasons. People in the region perceive the United States, rightly they say, as supporting oppressive harsh governments which block democracy and development and doing it because we want control of their oil resources.

No one likes to be manipulated by foreign powers. That is why people that may not want bin Laden's ultimate goal of very fundamentalist Islamic governments still admire someone that strikes back at the foreign interference. Yes most people don't like the oppressive harsh governments which block democracy and it is the U.S. that is propping them up. bin Laden wants the Saudi Arabia government toppled. It is the U.S. that props that government up. (Most people in Suadi Arabia want more rights for women, so if it was a democracy it would be an improvement. U.S. businessmen don't give a damn about human rights in the region. They don't want the oil pie divided up with the general population. They PREFER to deal with undemocratic rulers.
After the Gulf War, the U.S. could have established a democracy in Kuwait if they really cared about the people there. They didn't.
You can look at case after case. The U.S. ousted a democratically elected leader in Iran and installed the Shah! Motive? Greed.

<< I really don't get your claim of Bush "lying" here at all. >>

again, notice how I quote evidence. you have produced nothing.
you keep repeating the big lie that the President and others want you to believe. (so that the policies that enrich the powerful can remain in place)

<< Because when the whole spectrum of what Bin Laden has said >>
example? give us a link and quote what it is that you think makes the point you are trying to make.

I support what I say with examples. Here is the newest example: Intelligence Officer Challenges Bush Administration on 'Why They Hate Us'VOANews.com
in a new book entitled Through Our Enemies' Eyes, one senior American intelligence officer, simply dubbed "Anonymous," sharply disagrees with that view.
"There are a lot of people who say he hates our freedoms, as you said, or hates our liberties, and hates us for what we are, rather than what we do," said the author. "That is a very common piece of analysis, and I think it is entirely wrong. Bin Laden has resonance in the Muslim world because he has focused his dislike for the things we do, not what we are."

"He has not identified our culture, our society, as the main enemy or as the main reason to fight us. What he has identified are specific U.S. foreign policy actions and activities that have a resonance among Muslims all over the world."

can you admit that I have gone above and beyond what most people here do to prove a point. give me some credit here. you STILL didn't quote a single bit of evidence. Come on. I am trying to get the truth out to the public to make Ameirca safer. don't be so stuborn. how can you argue with the above?
http://www.voanews.com/article.cfm?objectID=D65BA316-CA8F-4A99-AAAF9AB069C712F0

<< I can't help being curious as to how you know exactly what happened since our media is so remiss in reporting this to the public. >>
because I don't rely only on US media to get the news.
BBC NEWS | Programmes | From Our Own CorrespondÉThe coup that brought the Ba'ath Party to power in 1963 was celebrated by the United States.
The CIA had a hand in it. They had funded the Ba'ath Party - of which Saddam Hussein was a young member - when it was in opposition.
US diplomat James Akins served in the Baghdad Embassy at the time.
"I knew all the Ba'ath Party leaders and I liked them," he told me.
"The CIA were definitely involved in that coup. We saw the rise of the Ba'athists as a way of replacing a pro-Soviet government with a pro-American one and you don't get that chance very often.
"Sure, some people were rounded up and shot but these were mostly communists so that didn't bother us".
This happy co-existence lasted right through the 1980s.

<< Aren't you part of the public or do you have some private inside track to information which is not available to the rest of us? >>
the way the elites get away with the things they do is that the overwhelming majority of the American public doesn't make an effort to research and seek out news. Most people assume that the mainstream media will report what are the relevant facts. Most people don't understand that the mainstream media reporters are hired for and keep their jobs by reporting and not reporting things according to what the powerful interests want.

The above is just one example of this. With all the talk about Iraq, it is journalistic malpractice not to report how the Saddam situation started and the role the US played in it.

BBC NEWSÊÊÊ BBC Sport >>ÊÊÊGraphics version >>ÊÊÊChange to World edition >>
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Sunday, 26 January, 2003, 06:33 GMT

Saddam's parallel universe
Allan Little
BBC world affairs correspondent


For Saddam Hussein war against US and British forces would present enormous difficulties but, in all probability, nobody in his inner circle is telling him that.

When he took the decision to invade Kuwait - changing at a stroke the strategic shape of the world's most important energy-producing region - he consulted only three people.


" It seems part of the dictatorial condition to be surrounded by people who are too afraid to bring you bad news "

One was his cousin. The other two were his sons-in-law, the husbands of his daughters.

All three of these men were members of his Tikriti tribe - the clan which has governed Iraq for more than 30 years.

And when this tight-knit group takes a decision, no-one dares to challenge them.

It seems part of the dictatorial condition to be surrounded by people who are too afraid to bring you bad news.

We know this to be true of Zimbabwean President Robert Mugabe. And it is true of Saddam Hussein.

Inside knowledge

We know this because two of these men - the two sons-in-law - defected in 1995.

They turned up unannounced in Jordan looking for political asylum.

King Hussein put the head of his private office - General Ali Shukri - in charge of them.

They told him everything - how the inner circle makes its decisions, how Saddam's two sons, Uday and Qusay, had begun to assert their claims to political power, how Saddam had never abandoned his long-standing ambition to acquire a nuclear bomb.

We know it, too, because the man who was head of Iraq's army in 1990, when the invasion took place, General Nizar al-Khazraji, fled the country a few years later and is now, in effect, under house arrest in Denmark.

He told us that he knew nothing of the plans to invade Kuwait.

He heard the news like everyone else - on the radio.

When he told Saddam Hussein a few days later that Iraq could not possibly defeat an American-led invasion attempt, he was sacked.

Dictators do not want to hear news like this. They do not listen.

Fatal truths

The then deputy head of military intelligence, Wafiq al-Sammurrai, is another of the top brass who have fled the country.

I went to see him in the little flat in Surrey which is now his home.


" You will die if you tell him [that invading Kuwait is a mistake] "
Wafiq al-Sammurrai
former deputy head of military intelligence

I asked him whether he had told Saddam Hussein that the invasion was a mistake.

"You can't tell him this face to face," he said.

"Nobody can tell him this. You will die if you tell him this. Everybody is afraid".

One man who did tell him to his face to get out of Kuwait was the deputy US ambassador to Iraq, Joe Wilson.

He had a meeting with Saddam four days after the invasion.

Saddam offered America a deal:

We keep Kuwait, he said, though we are not sure yet what to do with it. And if you Americans don't make a fuss, we can come to a mutually beneficial arrangement about cheap oil supplies and, in addition, we Iraqis will promise not to threaten Saudi Arabia.

Why did Saddam believe the United States would be amenable to such an offer?

It was not simply that he was surrounded by terrified yes men.

It also reflects the way he understood his relationship with the United States.

Iraq's 'special relationship'

The coup that brought the Ba'ath Party to power in 1963 was celebrated by the United States.

The CIA had a hand in it. They had funded the Ba'ath Party - of which Saddam Hussein was a young member - when it was in opposition.

US diplomat James Akins served in the Baghdad Embassy at the time.

"I knew all the Ba'ath Party leaders and I liked them," he told me.

"The CIA were definitely involved in that coup. We saw the rise of the Ba'athists as a way of replacing a pro-Soviet government with a pro-American one and you don't get that chance very often.

"Sure, some people were rounded up and shot but these were mostly communists so that didn't bother us".

This happy co-existence lasted right through the 1980s.

When the Ayatollah Khomeini seized power in Iran in 1979, America set about turning Saddam Hussein into Our Man in the Gulf Region.

Washington gave Baghdad intelligence support.

President Reagan sent a special presidential envoy to Baghdad to talk to Saddam in person.

The envoy's name was Donald Rumsfeld.

Blind eye

Everyone knew that Saddam was using chemical weapons against Iranian conscripts.

When 5,000 Kurds were gassed at Halabja in 1988, Kurdish leaders turned to America for help. Mahmoud Osman was one of them.

"I couldn't get any of my friends in the State Department to return my calls," he said.

"They told me we cannot listen to you when you talk about chemical weapons because we do not want to jeopardise our relations with the Iraqis".

So this also explains why Saddam got it all so badly wrong in 1991.

America and the West had turned a blind eye to everything he had done for over a decade.

No-one dared tell him that the invasion of Kuwait would be any different.

Rule of terror

Two of those four men who took that fatal decision were in the end burned by it.

The sons-in-law who defected to Jordan stayed six months and then decided to return, apparently convinced that Saddam had forgiven them.

"I warned them," General Shukri told me, "that they would be executed within seven days of crossing the border.

"I was wrong. They were executed within two days".

This is the nature of Saddam's rule.

Even those who sit at his right hand, who help him govern the Republic of Fear, are not safe.

Those who perpetrate the fear are themselves victims of it.

'Weaned by the West'

Last week I met a major from Saddam's detested security service the Mukhabarat who had recently defected.

He told me he was ashamed of his career in the service of the dictator.

I asked him why he had not left his job.

"Listen to me," he said.

"I have a wife, a family, a boy. If I leave, he will kill him. Do you know what that means?

"Yes I am ashamed. But I am from this country.

"Not only I helped Saddam Hussein. America helped him, Britain helped him. He's your guy. He's your son."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/low/world/from_our_own_correspondent/2694885.stm
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The New York Times called upon an expert on terrorism to offer his thoughts on how to counter the plague. His advice, based upon long experience, was straightforward: ÒThe terrorists, and especially their commanders, must be eliminated.Ó He gave three examples of successful counterterrorist actions: the US bombing of Libya, the Israeli bombing of Tunis, and IsraelÕs invasion of Lebanon. He recommends more of the same Òif the civilized world is to prevail.Ó The Times editors gave his article the title: ÒItÕs Past Time to Crush The Terrorist Monster,Ó and they highlighted the words: ÒStop the slaughter of innocents.Ó They identify the author solely as ÒIsraelÕs Minister of Trade and Industry.Ó His name is Ariel Sharon.(New York Times (September 30, 1986)) His terrorist career, dating back to the early 1950s, includes the slaughter of 69 villagers in Qibya and 20 at the al-Bureig refugee camp in 1953; terrorist operations in the Gaza region and northeastern Sinai in the early 1970s including the expulsion of some ten thousand farmers into the desert, their homes bulldozed and farmlands destroyed in preparation for Jewish settlement; the invasion of Lebanon undertaken in an effort Ñ as now widely conceded Ñ to overcome the threat of PLO diplomacy; the subsequent massacre at Sabra and Shatilla; and others.

Some might feel that the choice of Ariel Sharon to provide Òthe civilized worldÓ with lessons on how to Òstop the slaughter of innocentsÓ may be a little odd, perhaps perverse, possibly even hypocritical. But that is not so clear. The choice is not inconsistent with the values expressed in action and the intellectual culture expressed in words Ñ or in silence.

In support of this conclusion, we may observe that the remedy for international terrorism Ñ at least, a substantial component of it Ñ is within our grasp. But no action is taken to this end, and indeed the matter is never discussed and is even inconceivable in respectable circles. Rather, one finds accolades to our benevolent intentions and nobility of purpose, our elevated Òstandards of democracy, freedom and humanism,Ó sometimes flawed in performance. Elementary facts cannot be perceived and obvious thoughts are unthinkable. Simple truths, when expressed, elicit disbelief, horror, and outrage Ñ at the fact that they are voiced.

In a moral and intellectual climate such as this, it may well be appropriate for the worldÕs greatest newspaper to select Ariel Sharon as our tutor on the evils of terrorism and how to combat it.

http://www.americanstateterrorism.com/books/WesternStateTerrorism.html

<< GOOD Q. WONDERFUL !Ê IF SADDAM DID NOT HAVE W.M.D TELL US WHY DID HE NOT INVITE THE WORLD TO COME AND SHOW US SEE ALL WE WANTED TO SEE >>


he did do that. He was proactively cooperating. Remember? the Bush team claimed it was a trick. remember?

Top UN weapons experts reported Friday that Iraq was showing new signs of cooperation with inspection efforts, prompting a majority of Security Council member nations to call for giving the inspections more time to work before resorting to the use of force to disarm Saddam Hussein's regime.

After the inspectors suggested that Iraq's programs to develop weapons of mass destruction were being successfully contained, an exasperated Secretary of State Colin Powell abandoned his prepared speech and warned that the Security Council should not be duped by "tricks that are being played on us."

http://www.chicagotribune.com/chi-0302150221feb15,0,4756936.story?coll=chi-news-hed

http://people-press.org/commentary/display.php3?AnalysisID=46
<< A PEW Survey may be worth reading about the United States foreign policies. International Surveys: What We Are Finding >>


confirms one again what has been known for 50 years.

The bottom line is greedy powerful people are using US foreign policies to make themselves rich. They dictate US foreign policies such as supporting kings and oppressive rulers (installing them in many instances) and much of what they do is kept out of the public's view.
in mainstream media, people play the game (they wouldn't be hired if it wasn't clear that they were going to omit certain facts from their reporting)
we weren't told that the US was responsible for putting the Baath party into power in the firts place. not telling people about this is "playing the game".
these crimes continue because thanks largely to the influence of the media, they can't imagine that US foreign policies would be abused by U.S. businessmen..

bin Laden could not have flown the planes himself.

the racism still percists to a degree that that is what they do, that blacks would go out a kill (ignoring the conditions under which the slaves revolted in 1940's

<< The terrorist attack on 9/11 is related to past American foreign policy -- in short, America's own fault; >>

Would you grow up?
Your blindly support US foreign polices and you try to make it impossible for rational discussion about the policies by making it adversarial. "America" what is that? Do most people know that US foreign polices have screwed over Middle East people.
"own fault" what does this mean? ALL fault? No fault at all?
You think FUNDING and SUPPORTING the most extreme elements that undermined and destroyed the lives of millions of people is faultless?

You think supporting and organizing coups to place the Baath party into power is faultless?

You think backing king is faultless. We are a people that freed themselves from a king. Do you seriously not understand how evil it is to SUPPORT kings and oppressive rulers and make it impossible for the people to have democracy? you think someone can do horrible things to a people and remain totally faultless?

Tell me about your opinion on Nat Turner. (he and other blacks killed over 50 whites)
do you want to talk about blame in that case?

<< 've been saying the same thing to you liberals for 3 years: bush is our president....LIVE WITH IT. >>


What the hell does this have to do with ignoring potential war crimes?
Answer this: why do we even lock people up in America for crimes? Why? Because we want a moral and just society. What is it with you freaks that can't get that into your heads?
Just as we demand that people in American obey the law, so too should we insist on lawful and just actions in foreign affairs. what the hell is it going to take for you to understand that holding people accountable and to the law is a necessity? what the hell is it going to take for you to understand that we must hold ALL our people accountable, even when they are doing things to foreigners.
we had to beat it into your heads that discrimination and racism in the US is wrong. you finally got that? now listen: for your next lesson you need to understand that no one is above the law and that we will indeed hold public officials responsible EVEN WHEN THEY ACT OVERSEAS. got it?